Constructive Criticism for AngryAussie

This is a blog response to AngryAussie’s blog post which you can read here

http://angryaussie.wordpress.com/2010/05/30/why-i-dont-give-a-fuck-about-male-circumcision-zealots/

Now AngryAussie has been a good friend of mine and it does pain me to write this.  I am hoping that he will listen to these words of constructive criticism.  I have been a subscriber of his since 2007 and back in the summer of 2008 he did subscribe to me.  That made my day.  He has been very kind and always willing to lend a helping hand to smaller youtube channels and has organized many YouTube gatherings in Australia.

However one minor complaint that I have had of him is his lack of tolerance for those who criticize his views.  A few months back he addressed why he does this.

Now, I am quite aware that Mr Angry is just his internet persona, and that it is just an act.  However there are times such as his recent rant on circumcision that I believe he is being serious.  I believe that he is really trying to convince people of his way of thinking.  If that is the case then, I would advise him that he does this, he should be ready to withstand criticism.

I have made many videos where I try to convince others that I am right on an issue.  I know, I always know that there is going to be someone who is going to call bullshit on me if I get something wrong.  All of my claims must be based on fact and not opinion.  The internet has no tolerance for those who can’t back up their claims with evidence.

Now AngryAussie has every right to censor the comments on his youtube channel and on his blog posting here on this site.  However doing this tells me three things.

  1. He is not willing to learn new information, therefore he has chosen to be willfully ignorant
  2. He is not willing to back up his claims with evidence
  3. He is not willing to admit that his previous claims have been debunked.

Now lets get into the meat of the matter.

AngryAussie believes that female circumcision is wrong and barbaric.  He is correct.

However his belief that those who oppose male circumcision are somehow doing so because they feel they have been forever emotionally traumatized is a flawed argument.  I would like to quote from his blog that he posted back in 2006 which can bee seen here

http://angryaussie.wordpress.com/2006/05/08/not-without-my-foreskin/

It strikes me as absurd and perhaps more than a little sick, that in a world so full of problems and injustice, some men can treat the fact they were circumcised as one of the biggest travesties of modern life

While that may be true for some who oppose circumcision it certainly is not true for all, and to say otherwise is demonstrably not true.  For example, Dr Dean Edell, a nationally syndicated medical talk show host has been a frequent critic of circumcision for both male and female and he does so on sound research that can be backed up.

People like myself who speak out on male circumcision do so, not because we lament the loss of our foreskin, but because we see it as a needless medical procedure that is very painful for the child and can hinder his sexual performance.  We speak out on male circumcision simply to prevent future babies from being circumcised.  Nothing more.

In that same blog post from 2006 AngryAussie wrote:

I’m sure these foreskin evangelists will say that I, as a circumcised male who doesn’t give a shit, am in denial. But excuse me if there’s a few injustices I want to sort out before I bother with “the crime of circumcision”.

To that I would simply reply, why then do you speak out against female circumcision.  Certainly there are more problems in the world that need greater attention than female circumcision.   To name a few, we have economy that needs to be rebuilt.  We are in a war and currently fight to maintain occupation of two countries.  Slavery is still being practiced in a few places in Africa.  We have global warming, and the BP oil disaster that not only will scar the ocean life in that region but will cause oil prices to sky rocket.

So simply because there are more pressing matters to address than female circumcision, does that mean we should remain silent?  No.  We can speak out against global warming, we can press our nations leaders for tighter controls over oil drilling.  We can speak out against the war or in favor of it, and we can even make time for female circumcision.

So why not speak out against all circumcision?  Why only condemn female circumcision?  I have yet to get an answer to this.  AngryAussie why won’t you condemn male circumcision?  It is a simple question.

Previously you have said this, in your blog post from 2006

I will go on record as saying circumcision is unnecessary. I don’t think anyone’s built a compelling case for a medical need or even significant benefit for circumcision

So you obviously believe that it is a needless procedure.  However, do you believe that it is wrong and that it should be criminalized?  Yes or no.

You state the following for condemning female circumcision in your most recent blog post here

http://angryaussie.wordpress.com/2010/05/30/why-i-dont-give-a-fuck-about-male-circumcision-zealots/

To say that male circumcision is the same as female genital mutilation is unsupportable both logically and morally. Male circumcision removes the foreskin either for cultural or health reasons (you’re free to say this is pointless – I really don’t give a fuck about arguing the point). The point of circumcision is NOT to impair the function of the penis or the male enjoyment of sex. In the rare cases when something goes wrong with a circumcision and there is some damage that was NEVER the INTENTION of the procedure.

Female genital mutilation is specifically designed to damage the sexuality and sexual enjoyment of women for religious and/or cultural reasons. It is a premeditated violent act that frequently causes long term physical trauma and pain for the girls and women it is performed on. It is specifically about repressing and punishing women simply because they are women.

The two act are not the same in either effect or intention. To claim male circumcision is “just as bad” is quite frankly disgusting and reprehensible. The level of self-absorption required to make such a statement stuns me.

What baffles me is this clearly contradicts his blog post from 2006 in which he said this:

Dr John Harvey Kellog (yes, the cornflakes inventor) proclaimed: “The remedy for masturbation which is almost always successful in small boys is circumcision.” Yeah, nice one Dr K. I’m circumcised and, not that I’m of the opinion that masturbation needs to be “cured”, I can safely assure the good doctor that he was off the mark with that idea.

So AngryAussie is well aware of the medical history that some doctors promoted circumcision as a way to reduce sexual pleasure.  Even as early as the 12 century it was believed that circumcision could reduce sexual pleasure in males.

http://www.cirp.org/library/cultural/maimonides/

Now to those who would discredit such evidence because it comes from an anti-circumcision website need to do one thing.  Prove that Moses Maimonides, the author cited, never said the things in that article.  Before you can discredit that link, you must prove that it is a forgery.  You will also need to provide evidence of the forgery.  Now, we can certainly debate on the merits of that article, after all it was based on 12 century knowledge of biology.  However, it can not be denied that even as early as the 12 century there were those who promoted circumcision to reduce sexual pleasure.

When circumcision was promoted here in western cultures in the 19th century it was done so for similar reasons.  Medical knowledge was lacking and even AngryAussie admitted in 2006 that some promoted it as a cure for masterbation.  Here is a link to some quotes from medical professionals of that era.

http://www.noharmm.org/docswords.htm

Like before, in order to discredit that link because it is a anti-circumcision website you must document that the quotes listed are either in error, or misrepresentations of what was actually said.

Furthermore to say that people do not circumcise girls for medical reasons is simply not true.  There are those who try to justify this practice on scientific principals.  Here is one such example

According to a book by David Gollaher, Circumcison: A history of the world’s most controversial surgery, proponents of female circumcision cite  reduced sexual desire, lower risk of vaginal cancer and AIDS, less nervous anxiety, fewer infections “from microbes gathering under the hood of the clitoris” and protection against herpes and genital ulcers as health benefits.  Now these guys are completely Froot Loops, but this is how they justify it.

Likewise most pediatric associations in the world today no longer recommend circumcision.  As far as the health risks such as penile cancer or urinary tract disease, men are far more likely to suffer from breast cancer.  Futhermore, why should we surgically remove part of our body on the mere chance that it might get sick.  We all age, and with age comes health problems.

As far as the risk of aids, the problem with that study is that many in Africa, where that study was conducted either did not use condoms for religious beliefs or simply did not always have access to them.  The control group for that study was far from adequate.  The best way to reduce the risk of Aids and other STD’s is to use a condom and practice a monogamous or celebate lifestyle.

AngryAussie has been told this over and over and over.  The fact is he simply keeps deleting comments and blocking people.  He can not claim ignorance of this information.  He is more than welcome to dispute the evidence, but so far has not done so.  So far every answer to people trying to educate him has been to shout them down.

I have tried my best to find some comments in his youtube video but most of them he has deleted.  I have however saved some of his comment replies to his blog post.  Remember in each time the person commenting was not emotional non-sense but was respectfully giving their feedback based on scientific evidence

AngryAussie if you don’t want people disagreeing with you in your blogs and videos, then DISABLE THE FUCKING COMMENTS!!!!  Do not enable comments and then get upset when people ask you to back up your claims.

The main point of this essay is to ask one simple question.  AngryAussie if you get this upset when people challenge your view points, why express them?  If you truly want to change people’s mind, you must be willing to admit when you are wrong and be open to new ideas as they come along.

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4 Responses

  1. Just wanted to make sure the comments were set to automatic

  2. Also I don’t log in here much, so the best way to contact me about this blog is to send me a message to my youtube channel

    http://www.youtube.com/happycabbie

    Or send a message via twitter @happycabbie

  3. I added a comment to his blog, with the following information, and it was deleted.

    The person who commented on his blog under the name “Jake” is Jake H. Waskett. Jake is a member of Circlist (a circumcision fetish site). He has spoken of his circumcision fetish before, where he said he (and others) gets enjoyment from the circumcision procedure itself. Now he spends every day for the past 5 years editing any and all Wikipedia articles related to circumcision to make sure they look like a pro-circumcision brochure.

    I don’t really care how anyone here feels about circumcision, whether you are for or against it. But there is something really fucking sick about someone who GETS OFF on circumcisions. That takes a special brand of pedophile.

  4. I agree, Rule 34 obviously applies to everyone.

    I honestly can’t imagine someone fapping to the circumcision videos uploaded to youtube. That takes the cake for sure.

    However, I would like to year your thoughts on the matter? Should male and female circumcision be outlawed for babies and children, with the exception for medical emergency?

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